Forums, Comments, etc.

Shouldn’t a Digital Recording Sound the Same on CD and Vinyl?

Hot Stamper Pressings of the Music of Dire Straits Available Now

UPDATE 2026

These comments are taken from a reddit thread that Geoff Edgers and I were on years ago talking about Hot Stampers. I would add that the audience seemed to have very little experience with high-end audio. Based on the comments I read, most of them, like most audiophiles, especially audiophile record collectors, thought I was selling snake oil.

(Doesn’t it strike you as odd that no one ever seems to bring up the fact that we make a point of explaing to you exactly how to find your own snake oil?)

Someone asked a question about vinyl for digital recordings. Discussing the difference I typically hear between CDs and vinyl pressings, I offered the opinions you see below. (We might have been talking about Brothers in Arms; I honestly don’t remember and don’t think it matters anyway.)

For those of you newer to the blog, please keep in mind that, unlike a great many fans of analog, I actually like the sound of the hundreds of CDs I own and make a point to play them regularly for enjoyment. Properly mastered CDs can sound shockingly good.

In my experience, a good CD will wipe the floor with the vast majority of Heavy Vinyl records being made today. If you are buying modern remastered records, I highly recommend you stop and instead make the effort to find a good CD player and buy vintage — and even some of the better gold — CDs.

My comments:

Well, a too short version would be something like:

On the vinyl and on the CD the tonality should be identical.

If it is not you have problems and you need to do some work to find them and fix them.

Assuming correct tonality, the CD should be big, lively and clear, assuming you have a good CD player and a good CD.

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When you read a review of a record that was obviously reproduced with inferior equipment, what’s your first reaction?

When You’re Just Getting Started in Audio…

Mine is typically “what an idiot!“

But then you might step back and, with a moment’s reflection recognize that you yourself have written seriously mistaken reviews back in the days when your equipment was inferior, and have to recognize “that could have been me, and maybe not all that long ago.“ Here’s one from the mid-90s, about twenty years after I had purchased a pair of rather large floor standing speakers and a number of highly-rated, very expensive hi-fidelity components to drive them.

But all that hardware and all that money could not tell me how awful sounding some records were, and there are plenty more like that ridiculous remastered pressing from my past.

In fact, there are so many that we thought they deserved their own special category here on the blog, under the heading dubious sounding records I once liked.

The explanation for all the nonsense one reads on the web could not be simpler or more obvious.

The lo-fi to mid-fi crowd doesn’t know what it’s missing and telling them doesn’t do them (or you) any good because they are not where they need to be yet. They are not where you are — they are where they are. And that just happens to be the same place you were at some point in your journey.

They are in the hole you used to be in. The difference is you managed to climb out of that hole. They’re still in it.

Keep in Mind

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Some Thoughts on Testing in Audio

Robert Brook runs a blog called The Broken Record, with a subtitle explaining that his blog is:

A GUIDE FOR THE DEDICATED ANALOG AUDIOPHILE

Some THOUGHTS on TESTING in AUDIO

My Two Cents

I made a couple of quick notes and sent them by email to Robert, as follows:

  • One record is not enough for this test, or any other for that matter, and
  • Tests need to be blinded.

Without blinding all you are doing is confirming your prejudices, which is something you correctly point out in your piece, and no matter how much you want to think you aren’t doing that because you are trying so hard to guard against it, it is almost surely what you will end up doing.

Confirmation bias is at the heart of most mistaken audio judgments, something I learned a very long time ago, and only after making every kind of mistake there is to make, over the course of decades no less. Only one thing had the power to set me on the right path, and without it I would never have learned how to make any real progress in audio, or find better sounding records for that matter.

If you don’t know how to run good experiments, how can you be sure your results are of any value?

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Letter of the Week – “The energy, the bass, the clarity was all there. I still can’t get over it.”

Hot Stamper Pressings of the Music of Heart Available Now

One of our good customers had this to say about some Hot Stampers he purchased a while ago (emphasis added):

Hey Tom,   

Hope you don’t mind me E-mailing you with comments on my recent purchase of Dreamboat Annie but I’m busting to tell somebody. 

I am stunned. I had one “run of the mill” copy and one of the Nautilus albums which I thought was pretty good.

It’s good if you never hear a Hot Stamper. The Hot Stamper just blew them both away.

I read the description of the HS on your site and every word was spot on. The energy, the bass, the clarity was all there. I still can’t get over it.

Near the end of Magic Man the synthesizer goes down to a very low octave and just drags you with it and keeps you there. It’s amazing.

It’s hard to understand why these people on the audio forums mock and degrade you guys. I guess they are afraid to spend a little money and see what a Hot Stamper sounds like. I have a feeling even if they knew how good the HS was they still would not buy one simply because it’s more money than they are willing to part with. So to justify not buying one they put the Hot Stamper down.

It’s just my opinion. They sure don’t know what they’re missing.

Only bad thing about you guys is once you hear how good a record can sound, the rest of your collection kind of takes a back seat to the HS. Oh well, I can’t stop now.

Steve E.

Steve,

Thanks for writing. We used to like the Nautilus pressing of Dreamboat Annie about as much as you did. Here’s our review.

Once you hear just how good the best pressings can sound, it becomes clear that the Nautilus is not worth the vinyl it’s pressed on, but until then, it’s certainly a good sounding record, just not as good as the real thing.

Our explanation for the mistaken judgments we audiophiles make is not complicated. As you may have read elsewhere on this blog, it all boils down to three little words.

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Straight Up – Porky Not So Prime Cut

Hot Stamper Pressings of the Music of Badfinger Available Now

UPDATE 2026

This commentary has been updated multiple times, most recently in 2025.

British band, British pressing… right?

Nope. It’s just another mistaken idea.

We evaluated an original British pressing in our shootout, unbeknownst to me as it was playing of course. And guess where it finished: dead last.

The most thick, congested, crude, distorted, compressed sound of ALL the copies we played.

We love the work of Porky, Pecko, et al. in general, but once again this is a case where a British Band recorded in England sounds best on domestic vinyl. (McCartney’s first album on Apple is the same way.)

Just saw this today (11/29/2021)

On November 18, 2019, a fellow on Discogs who goes by the name of Dodgerman had this to say referencing the original UK pressing of Straight Up, SAPCOR 19:

So Happy, to have a first UK press, of this lost gem. Porky/Pecko

Not sure what those two commas are doing there. Pausing for emphasis? Sure, why not? This is a big deal.

Like many record collectors, he is happy to have a mediocre-at-best, dubby-sounding original pressing, poorly mastered by a famous mastering engineer, George Peckham, a man we know from extensive experience to be responsible for cutting some of the best sounding records we’ve ever played. He is truly one of the greats.

Is Dodgerman an audiophile? He might be, or at least he might choose to describe himself as one.

Many audiophiles employ this kind of mistaken audiophile thinking, believing that a British band’s albums must sound their best on British vinyl for some reason, possibly a cosmic one.

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What Do Audiophiles Think about Analog?

Robert Brook runs a blog called The Broken Record, with a subtitle explaining that his blog is:

A GUIDE FOR THE DEDICATED ANALOG AUDIOPHILE

We know of none better, outside of our own humble attempt to enlighten that portion of the audiophile community who love hearing music reproduced with the highest fidelity and are willing to go the extra mile to make that happen.

What Do AUDIOPHILES THINK About ANALOG?

Looking at the picture above, I’d say it probably gives a great many of them a headache.

And why shouldn’t it? It sure looks easy, and the fact that everyone who writes about it, reviewers and forum posters alike, seems to think it is easy. They all seem to think that all you have to do to get good sound is to buy the right equipment and play the right records — mastered by the right people, of course — and you are good to go.

But it actually turns out to be hard, so hard that some people — no doubt many of the ones who bought into the idea that it was easy in the first place — want to throw in the towel and move on to something else, preferably something that offers more bang for their hard-earned bucks.

If I had taken the above advice, and bought the remastered records the so-called experts have been recommending to audiophiles like me for decades, who knows, I might have thrown in the towel too.

But I was obsessed with music, and obsessed people don’t give up on anything easily. (The result, for what it’s worth, is hundreds of great sounding records for sale and thousands of blog postings.)

My Two Cents about Robert’s Post

(the slightly edited version taken from the comments)

Robert,
Thanks for taking on some of the more specious arguments — as well as some very good ones, to be sure — advanced by the music lovers you quote.

Job well done, and one that I could never have taken on as it would have made my head explode right at the start.

I wrote a piece recently about what I believe is fundamentally at the heart of the many misunderstandings music lovers of these various persuasions are unable to overcome.

It’s far more esoteric than the many good points you make. I’m assuming that at this stage of the game we can all agree that analog is superior to digital.

What I am trying to do is to get audiophiles to listen critically enough to recognize that no two sides of the same record have the same qualities in the same proportion, that variations in sound quality are almost unavoidable, and that record shootouts are the only way to bring this idea home to the typical analog audiophile enthusiast.

You can find it under the heading of breaking barriers and crossing bridges.

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Getting Fooled, or Fooling Yourself?

Basic Concepts Every Audiophile Should Understand

This excerpt is from a longer commentary we wrote in 2022 about the digital step (the horror!) Mobile Fidelity was secretly using to make their so-called One Step pressings.

What follows is one way to look at what happened and who it happened to.

This gentleman you see pictured, a certain Mike Esposito, made a foolish mistake.

He bought into the hype of the Modern Audiophile Remastered Record hook, line and sinker.

Rather than being skeptical, he wanted to believe what they told him.

He did not use his own ears to make judgments, he let others — reviewers, fellow audiophiles, the label itself — tell him what was pure and good.

Now he has learned that he was misinformed by those in whom he placed his trust. Even worse, he was lied to by the label he… is worshipped to strong a word?

He was also misinformed by the audiophile reviewers who should have known something was wrong. Not being able to recognize the shortcomings in the sound of these pressings was entirely predictable, since these reviewers never developed listening skills much better than those of Mr Esposito. (For more on just how out of his depth the man was, click here.)

His world has been turned upside down. But that’s not technically true — it was always upside down.

We know of practically no evidence to support the proposition that this label knows how to make good sounding records.  We wondered how they were still in business and have no expectation of ever getting any answer more helpful than “shut up.” (If you actually have evidence to support any claim you wish to make, we can help you do that.)

Finding good records and being able to reproduce them properly is hard. Perhaps now Mr Esposito is coming to appreciate just how little he knew about either.

UPDATE 2025

Based on the fact that he charges $1.99 per month — I kid you not — to advise his clients which are the best sounding pressings of the albums he auditions, it’s doubtful that he has learned anything from his experience of being fooled by Mobile Fidelity, along with all the other audiophile reviewers who apparently are as easily duped as he is. (Is there any job in the world requiring less in the way of qualifications than “audiophile record reviewer”?)

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System Neutrality — “Allowing the Music to Speak”

Robert Brook runs a blog called The Broken Record, with a subtitle explaining what the aim of his blog is:

A GUIDE FOR THE DEDICATED ANALOG AUDIOPHILE

We know of none better, outside of our own humble attempt to enlighten that portion of the audiophile community who love hearing music reproduced with the highest fidelity and are willing to go the extra mile to make that happen.

System NEUTRALITY: “ALLOWING the MUSIC to SPEAK”

An excerpt:

I am here to tell you, however, that in the few short hours that I spent with Robert and his system, I gained a tremendous amount of knowledge, both in technical tweaks and in the philosophy of how to listen. Despite owning either identical hardware or that of similar ilk (same speakers, cartridge, similar turntable, treatments, and so on). Robert’s system sounded fundamentally different from mine.”

This is surely the result of the large numbers of small changes — with potentially big effects — Robert made to his system, proof that the 80/20 rule is real.

If you click on the 80/20 link above you will find links to hundreds of test records at the bottom of the commentary, along with this paragraph:

These are the records that challenged me and helped me to achieve more progress in audio. If you want to improve your stereo, these are some of the best records we know of to help you take your system to the next level.

To that end, I recently compiled a list of seventy or so records that had been helpful in getting my system to sound better, mostly by working on the many problems I heard when attempting to hear them at their best over the course of the last forty-plus years.

These two were by far the most helpful, but, as I say, there were scores of them, records that I played hundreds and hundreds of times while I went about tweaking and testing. (That’s how I ended up with the lovely lattice all over my soundroom that you can see in the pictures below.)

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If You’re Just Getting Started, Beware of LPs that Will Inhibit Your Progress

Hot Stamper Pressings of Blue Note Albums Available Now

Robert Brook wrote a scathing review of the Tone Poets pressing of One Flight Up in 2023, much to the dissatisfaction of some of his readers. I was the first to leave a comment as I thought he hit the nail on the head when he said:

Overall, the Tone Poet is closed, distant and frankly boring to listen to. Where is the energy of the music? Where is the presence of these musicians? Where is the studio space?

The snare sounds muted. the piano weak, the horns, especially Gordon’s saxophone, resolves poorly and becomes increasingly tiresome to listen to. On my first listen I lasted about 3 minutes into side 1, mostly because I couldn’t stand the way the sax was sounding.

I posted the comments below on Robert’s review. (I have taken the liberty to rewrite some of my comments for the purposes of clarity, along with some additional thoughts.)

Robert,

Another great post. I have many comments to make, so here goes.

When audiophiles prefer records which are clearly second-rate, more often than not I chalk it up to their lack of a better record to play. In order to hear what they are missing, they have to have a record that somehow makes clear to them precisely which aspects of the sound are failing, or at the very least, not up to par.

You could give out the stamper numbers for your Blue Note reissue — I would be surprised if it does not have VAN GELDER STEREO in the dead wax — and those who like the Tone Poets release of One Flight Up could easily find one on Discogs or Ebay and do the comparison for themselves.

But you know what? I would bet you dollars to donuts they will never do that. They simply won’t bother.

To some audiophiles who collect records, collecting is simply not about sound quality.

It’s about collecting the right audiophile pressings.

These folks don’t want some old Blue Note reissue from the 70s. They want a fancily-packaged remastered record on high quality vinyl that’s made by a label that really cares. If it’s a numbered limited edition, even better!

If these people wanted to find out what is wrong with the sound of the Tone Poets pressing you played — thanks for laying it all out in detail so no one can doubt that you listened carefully and heard what’s really in those grooves — they could easily find a vintage copy of the record that would make a mockery of the one they own.

Twenty years ago I wrote something about this very subject:

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A Few Questions for the Record Reviewing Community Regarding Counting Crows

More Entries from Tom’s Audiophile Notebook

I think I originally posted this in the comments section for Steve Westman’s youtube channel, but, to be honest, I cannot remember as it was way back in 2023 when I wrote it.

Tom Port here. Hello all. I come in peace with a quick question.

Much is made of price points when discussing these modern pressings, and rightfully so.

I admittedly do not know anything about The Counting Crows record being discussed, but I wanted to know more — what was available, from what year, mastered by whom, that sort of thing — so I went to Discogs to see what vinyl versions had been pressed recently.

The original import LP is probably made from a dub, or mastered right off the CD — that used to happen a lot in the 90s. (My beloved Jellyfish Spilt Milk on import vinyl is a dubby joke compared to every other copy I have, including the cassette. Watch for a review of the Omnivore LP coming to the blog soon.)

Then Analogue Productions put out a version in 2012, cut by Ryan Smith, which can be seen here.

There are 16 for sale starting at $127.49. It’s two discs at 45 RPM.

Chris Bellman cut the record in 2017, and his version can be found here.

CB in the deadwax. 2 discs at 33.

There are 43 available from $25.36. Since those were manufactured by Rainbo records, the vinyl may be terrible. Their stuff often is. I gave up buying their pressings in the 90s because they were so often warped and noisy.

Then there is one other which is a bit of a mystery, with no date of release, this one.

No CB in the dead wax. 2016 on the copyright info on the label though.

8 are available for $37.99

Question

Which one sounds the best?

Seems to me that this would be valuable information for your viewers to have. Why spend $100+ for an audiophile pressing when there are so many others around?

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